Traveller-digest    Wednesday, October 20 1999    Volume 1999 : Number 1232



(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.
All rights reserved.

The following topics are covered in this digest:

Re: PBeM TCS Islands Campaign
Re: caesarians
Re: Caesarians...
Re: Supporting our game...
re: caesarians
Re: Amorphous Aliens
RE: Amorphous Aliens
Re: Amorphous Aliens
RE: Cybernetic Implants
RE: Amorphous Aliens
Traveller 3D Model Sites
RE: Cybernetic Implants
Re: Zot!
archives
Re: Ditzie's Warrant Followup
Re: Space Opera?
Re: GTL9 5 dTon Shuttle
Re: Cardboard Heroes & Glenn Grant 
Aslan government types
Re: Battledress/Battlesuit Protection (GT)
J Andrew Keith CV
Re: Battledress/Battlesuit Protection (GT)
Re: Zot!
Re: archives
Re: Amorphous Aliens

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 06:33:18 -0500 (CDT)
From: Cynthia Higginbotham <cyhiggin@pipeline.com>
Subject: Re: PBeM TCS Islands Campaign

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca>
> To: traveller@mpgn.com <traveller@mpgn.com>
> Date: 18 October 1999 14:49
> Subject: Re: PBeM TCS Islands Campaign
> 
> I'm still in the process of writing up my initial draft of the house rules
> for this game, and will post them soon to the players. I'm also thinking of
> setting up a list on onelist or egroups, for general postings, and another
> for lurkers, but as I've never run a list before I'm not entirely certain
> what would be the best way of implementing this, advice gratefully accepted

Keep posting about this, and I'll finally be motivated to
put the designs and chronicles from Steve's PBeM TCS Islands campaign
of a few years back on my web page.  (Yes, I've mentioned this before,
I'm working on it as time allows.  Had to extract all the files from
DOS Framework III format...)

			--Cynthia

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 07:50:29 EDT
From: Tascelt@aol.com
Subject: Re: caesarians

Yes, my K is having an attitude....Perhaps too much cola spewed onto the ol' 
Keyboard.  Thanks!

TAS

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 22:58:47 +1000
From: "The Roc" <roc@kewl.com.au>
Subject: Re: Caesarians...

- ----- Original Message -----
From: Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca>
To: <traveller@mpgn.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 19, 1999 11:35 PM
Subject: RE: Caesarians



> >
> >And this is not scientific?
> <snipped>
>
> I believe that the point being made was that the increase in
> the relative number of caesarian births has been due to more
> and more women making the choice to avoid unnecessary pain
> and discomfort, rather than an increase in the necessity of
> caesarian deliveries caused by shrinking hips.
>
> Peez
>

Recent news in Australia suggests it is more the doctors choice, lessening
the risk of law suits as "natural birth" is still much the fav for the
majority of Aussie women... I cannot speak for other countries however.

- -- The Roc

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 23:14:31 +1000
From: "The Roc" <roc@kewl.com.au>
Subject: Re: Supporting our game...

- ----- Original Message -----
From: Craig Berry <cberry@cinenet.net>
To: <traveller@lists.imagiconline.com>
Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 1999 8:39 AM
Subject: Supporting our game



>
> > I now have to face the possibility that Traveller may not be
> > entertainment-in-a-vacuum -- that its appeal may be due to the 1970's,
> > with all its hard-SF influences and veteran wargamers.
>
> That much I do tend to agree with.  One thing I wonder about is why
> wargaming as a hobby went into a decline.  Some people point to the rise
> of computer gaming to explain this, but the decline of wargaming predated
> the availability of similarly complex computer substitutes by at least a
> decade.
>

I started building a WWII army (actually, both a German and
British/Commonwealth army) in 1/72nd scale, had 1000's of hand painted
troopies and was working on a decent collection of vehicles before I
realised that the cost was becoming greatly unrealistic.  When I originally
paid $0.85 (Aust) per vehicle for say a Sherman or Tiger tank, and $2.75 for
a gun and tractor combination which over the course of 5-years rose by
300-400% in cost, that was me out!

Lead miniatures went similar ways for massed armies I have seen in war game
clubs, being replaced by plastic only to become out-priced again.  I play
computer games (I played the old SSI titles on the C64 originally) because
they are "cheaper" than miniatures and easier to set up as well as being
"pre-painted"... but most because of the cost.  My wife has nothing against
me buying miniatures, but I don't see the value compared to what the money
could buy the family (I have 4x children too), but 90%+ of the war gamers I
know who are married -- I know it was their *wives* that put a stop to them.

- -- The Roc

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 09:32:47 -0400
From: Walter Smith <SmithW@HARTWICK.EDU>
Subject: re: caesarians

Robert Prior wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>Whichever procedure gets your family back home in the best of health
>is the right one.
>
>Walt Smith

Or, depending on the hospital, whichever procedure gets the doctor to his
golf game on time.
>>>>>>>>>
Thus the requirement for patients to become well-informed about their
conditions and their treatments. A doctor making medical decisions
based on tee times, IMO, deserves to be used for medical experiments.

My first child was born while our obstetrician was vacationing in the
Caribbean. His backup was tied up with another birth when my wife
delivered, an intern did a fine job helping with the delivery. Then the
Obstetrician popped her head in the door, asked if everything was OK,
and added her fee to the hospital's bill...

The hospital where my other two kids have been born was, IMO, a good
deal better. The care was mostly midwives who seemed to know
what they were doing, including how to talk to new parents. 
Their literature was interesting, I recall a line from it:
"Though you will be under the supervision of medical professionals,
Pregnancy is not a medical condition..."

ObTrav: I'll bet that, no matter how high the technology, good and bad
people will continue to make a big difference.

Walt Smith

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 11:33:41 -0400 (EDT)
From: Charles Collin <charles@hebb.psych.mcgill.ca>
Subject: Re: Amorphous Aliens

Hi all.

Frankie mentioned "The Green Brain" by Herbert.  I haven't read that one,
could you fill me in?  Let me guess, I've been scooped, right? :-)  Well,
there's nothing new under the suns...

Someone else (I forget who) mentioned a couple of other amorphous types,
again care to give me more details?

Thanks,
Charles.

PS. You might want to include spoiler warnings, if you deem them
appropriate...

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 11:43:20 -0400
From: Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca>
Subject: RE: Amorphous Aliens

Charles Collin writes:
<snipped>
>One thing I've always thought was "cool but hard to swallow"
>in SF is amorphous aliens.  Has anyone used something akin to
>these in their TU?
<snipped>
>I was thinking, what if such an insect species developed the
>trait of creating a membranous sac around the mass for further protection?
 What if, over time, hives developed into essentially
>single physical entities with queens at the center sending out
>pheromonal messages to control her "body", made up of a mass of
>workers.
<snipped>
>As evolution proceeded, the workers would lose much of the
>"baggage" needed to operate as individual entities, becoming
>essentially small cell masses with the ability to interlock with
>others in various configurations depending on the signals
>reaching them.  In order for intelligence to develop, the queen
>would have to become a massively hypertrophied thing with the
>brain integral to her alone, I think.  She would also become the
>seat of primary metabolic function and so on, sending out
>nutrients to the cell-masses that make up her body.

	This is an excellent scenerio for the evolution of a
	multi-unit organism, but you should add in a good
	reason that the super-organism remains unspecialized
	in form.  Perhaps it evolves underground, in passages
	and caverns where being large and reducing surface
	area are important, but being able to squeeze through
	small openings is crucial.  That's week, but maybe the 
	local environment changes drastically and often, so
	that extreme flexibility is crucial.

>Hmm, what about reproduction?  Essentially, one queen would
>lay another queen, who would "lay" a bunch of workers to act
>as a body for herself.

	And the new queen might take some of the "workers" and
	part of the exterior membrane with her, so that the
	superorganism splits just like an amoeba.

>Well, I said the idea was bizarre, didn't I? :-)  I'd really
>like to get people's input and reactions to this idea.  Too
>outlandish?  Are there major problems I haven't thought of?

	The biggest problems would be to get food and air to
	all parts of the organism, remove wastes from same, and
	compete with specialized organisms while remaining a
	large, relatively unspecialized mass.  Nevertheless,
	such an organism is no more inconceivable than some
	other aspects of Traveller.  I designed a Traveller
	T2-like robot, made up of subunits ranging in size from
	(relatively) simple nanites up to energy cell units
	5 cm across.  A biological version might also have been
	designed.  How about you post your creature when you 
	get it done?

Peez

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 08:35:58
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <gridlore@pop.mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Amorphous Aliens

At 08:16 PM 10/19/1999 -0400, you wrote:
>Hi all.
>
>One thing I've always thought was "cool but hard to swallow" in SF is
>amorphous aliens.  Has anyone used something akin to these in their TU? 

Read Robert Forward's _Rocheworld_.
- -- 

Douglas E. Berry       gridlore@mindspring.com
http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 11:57:13 -0400
From: Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca>
Subject: RE: Cybernetic Implants

Robert Eaglestone writes:
<snipped>
>Ok, here's a pseudo-psychobabble concept to bounce off all
you tech-heads.  How about this: I once heard (eek!
>unsubstantiated rumor!) that there is a little bit 'o gray
>matter in the fingertips... that is, your fingers do some
>data processing of their own... intelligent peripherals, in
>a really vague sense.

	Strictly speaking, "grey matter" is just neuron (nerve
	bell) bodies.  "White matter" is made up of axons (long
	projections from the cell bodies).  Processing occurs
	by complex systems of neurons connecting to each other
	by axons, but just because there are nerve cell bodies
	does not mean that there is information processing.  The
	touch receptors in your fingers are nerve cells, and in
	a sense the information is "processed" by neurons in the
	fingers, but such processing is rudimentary (like taking
	a series of various "beeps" and forwarding a regular
	"beep" on to the central nervous system).  It would be
	missleading to most people to call such cells "grey
	matter," nor such processing "intelligence."  There are
	ganglia (small bodies of grey matter that process data
	from various sources) found in our bodies (mostly near
	the spine), and both the ganglia and the spine are
	involved in such involuntary reactions as the "knee-jerk"
	reflex.

>Now, I also heard anecdotes -- not facts, mind you -- that folks
>who received transplants had personality side-effects that *seemed*
>to be related to the donor's personality... even though they didn't
>know the donor... oooh, a nice X-Files episode.

	I suspect that such claims have more to do with the
	psychological impact of losing an organ, and of having someone
	elses.

<snipped>

Peez

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 17:06:40 +0100
From: "Trevor, Peter" <Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com>
Subject: RE: Amorphous Aliens

> One thing I've always thought was "cool but hard to swallow" in
> SF is amorphous aliens.  Has anyone used something akin to these
> in their TU? 

IIRC, "Through The Eye Of The Needle" by Hal Clement  features  an
amorphous symbiotic alien (amorphous alien living inside a human).

I tried using it in my  TU  many  years  ago  and  ended  up  with
something not unlike the life form from the Demon planet  in  Star
Trek: Voyager (another amorphous alien).

Regards PLST
"Rome wasn't burned in a day."

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 11:12:39 -0500
From: "LLOYD ROBINSON" <LJR@sbscorp.com>
Subject: Traveller 3D Model Sites

Hi, 

I recently upgraded my computer and got a copy of trueSpace 4. I have 
seen model sites that have collections for Star Wars and Babalon 5. I was 
wondering if there were any sites like those that specialized in models for 
Traveller.

Lloyd

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 17:16:51 +0100
From: "Trevor, Peter" <Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com>
Subject: RE: Cybernetic Implants

Ian Ferguson wrote:
> Robert Eaglestone writes:
> <snipped>
> >Ok, here's a pseudo-psychobabble concept to bounce off all
> you tech-heads.  How about this: I once heard (eek!
> >unsubstantiated rumor!) that there is a little bit 'o gray
> >matter in the fingertips... that is, your fingers do some
> >data processing of their own... intelligent peripherals, in
> >a really vague sense.
>
>	Strictly speaking, "grey matter" is just neuron (nerve
>	bell) bodies.  "White matter" is made up of axons (long
>	projections from the cell bodies).
<snip>
>	There are
>	ganglia (small bodies of grey matter that process data
>	from various sources) found in our bodies (mostly near
>	the spine), and both the ganglia and the spine are
>	involved in such involuntary reactions as the "knee-jerk"
>	reflex.

I have heard that  some  complex  coordination  skills  (such  as
playing the piano) may be performed (at least partially)  in  the
spinal cord rather the brain.  This being so would the  recipient
of a spinal cord  transplant  from  a  concert  pianist  gain  an
aptiude for piano playing?

Regards PLST
"Rome wasn't burned in a day."

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 09:34:12 -0700 (PDT)
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com>
Subject: Re: Zot!

Leonard Erickson writes:
> Since when is ionization a bonus for a PAW? 

A high-current CPAW is basically a horizontal lightning bolt, and is dependent on an ionization path to act as a conductor to carry the current.
> 
> > The most likely thing to kill manned aircraft is increased viability of 
> > unmanned aircraft.
> 
> Yep.
> 
> Though this won't happen to miltary spacecraft. Remote control isn't
> practical above a few thousand km seperataton between controller and
> vehicle.

No, that just requires _better_ unmanned aircraft.  You don't want direct remote-piloted vehicles anyway, you want semi-autonomous drones which are given mission requirements by a remote controller, and that works reasonably well from several AU (witness planetary probes).  Otherwise its way to easy to take them out with a jammer.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 20:06:08 +0300
From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Jussi_Kenkkil=E4?= <Jussi.Kenkkila@helsinki.fi>
Subject: archives

Due to some unfortunate hassles with my computer, I've been out of touch of the
list for almost two months. Therefore I'd like to know where could I find the
planetology and xenobiology threads. If someone has archived them, please tell
me how I could obtain a copy. Also where are the digest archives located, and
how can I access them?

ps. Have I missed anything else interesting?

- -J2K

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 10:12:33 -0700
From: "Benyamene' ZeAbe' Akella" <xrp@sierratel.com>
Subject: Re: Ditzie's Warrant Followup

> Make sure "show graphics" is on in your browser.
> Jesse

Oh, I got that on. And all other sites come through fine, with pictures and
everything, it's just the warrant and credit 3 that are hiding behind some
fat byte somewhere. Strange.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 10:29:42 +0100
From: Mark Watson <markw@antares.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Space Opera?

On Wed, 20 Oct 1999, David P. Summers wrote:
>>The canon, the background, is pure space opera.  That doesn't mean it's
>>NOT hard SF.  You can have space opera without psionics, and with
>>gearheads.
>
>I've realized that Space Opera doesn't have a very good definition.  To
>some it is highly cinematic, soft science (banking space fighters "Lensmen
>type") SF.  To other is simply means that you have things that don't exist
>in modern society (FTL Travel, psionics, etc.).  Whether Traveller is Space
>Opera depends on your definition.
>

The following is from Brian Aldiss's intro to his anthology "Space Opera", and
also provides the extract used on the sleeve.

"Science fiction is a big muscular horny creature, with a mass of bristling
antennae and proprioceptors on its skull. It has a small sister, a gentle
creature with red lips and a dash of stardust in her hair. Her name is Space
Opera. This volume is dedicated to her ..."

"Science fiction is for real. Space opera is for fun. Generally."

"What space opera does is take a few light years and a pinch of reality and
inflate thoroughly with melodrama, dreams, and a seasoning of screwy ideas
..."

"I resist the impulse here to define space opera ... The term is both vague and
inspired, and must have been coined with both affection and some scorn,
analogously with soap opera and horse opera. And, analogously, with opera
itself, space opera has certain conventions which are essential to it, which
are, in a way, its raison d'etre; one may either like or dislike those
conventions, but they cannot be altered except at expense to the whole.
Ideally, the Earth must be in peril, there must be a quest and a man to match
the mighty hour. That man must confront aliens and exotic creatures. Space must
flow past the ports like wine from a pitcher. Blood must run down the palace
steps and ships launch out into the louring dark. There must be a woman fairer
than the skies and a villain darker than a Black Hole. And all must come right
in the end."

My take:

Hard science fiction isn't the only science fiction. There is science fiction
that puts the science before the fiction, and science fiction that places an
emphasis on the fiction above the science (eg CJ Cherryh, PK Dick, IM Banks,
Fred Pohl, numerous others). All I ask of science fiction is that whatever
ideas are developed have an internal consistency, and a believability within
that consistent context. I think Traveller has at its best striven for that
consistency. On the other hand, it contains numerous space opera tropes (for
example, the blood on the palace steps springs to mind). 

In the end you can play it either way. I think if you get to the position where
the players can, say, get involved in the assassination of Strephon and either
throw themselves in front of the death ray, or chase down the assassin - ie
where they move at the core of melodramatic events - you've got space opera.
But I think most people play it as science fiction, against a backdrop of
stars, to steal the title of one of Andy Slack's fine articles.

Mark
PS: If you get Aldiss's book, read the Sheckley story - now that's space opera.
- -- 
Mark Watson, markw@antares.demon.co.uk

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 18:19:46 +0100
From: John Buston <John.Buston@tesco.net>
Subject: Re: GTL9 5 dTon Shuttle

>>>But I wanted more than a couple hours of flight time.  

Then you want more than a cramped seat for the pilot. Look at pilot fatigue
under Routine Travel (p143). With no quarters, and a cramped seat the pilot
is suffering one point of fatigue per hour. Not very safe. To save space
consider using two roomy seats that fold up into a bunk and installing a small
galley (p77 Bunks & Short Occupancy Vehicles)

>I suspect there is some kind of toilet facilities included in the limited 
>life support system ... at least a septic tank that gets emptied like in 
>a Camper.

Limited life support only occupies 2 cubic feet including atmosphere scrubbers,
air-con/heaters & stuff. Not enough room for a toilet. Waste disposal is
included in quarters (p76). So I guess the crew have to bring their own buckets
;-)

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 13:56:41 -0400
From: "Keven R. Pittsinger" <jamstar@accesstoledo.com>
Subject: Re: Cardboard Heroes & Glenn Grant 

> Crap, I'd really meant to change the title to refer to what I was saying.
> Hate it when I do that!!!
> Jesse
> 
> 
> > I hereby nominate Glenn Grant to draw some NEW pictures for a new
> > set of Traveller Cardboard Heroes!  Who's with me?

As to the 2nd comment, *DEFINITELY*.  If he leaves the room, he's *elected*.

<grin>

As to the first comment, well, might be an idea to beersi *after* keyboarding, eh?

Keven

- -- 
tc++ tm+ tn t4- to ru++ ge+ 3i c+ jt au st- ls pi+ ta+ he+ so- vi zh sy
- ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                                                     Science-Fiction Adventure
                                                     In Reavers' Deep

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 20:19:30 CEST
From: "Sinclair ." <shallager@hotmail.com>
Subject: Aslan government types

Hi, everybody!

Old gamer, new to this list..

Ok, I admit it, I'm stoopit, but.. To make a short story shorter, I sold all 
my CT books about 10 years ago, when I got married and we tried to cram two 
households into one flat. Please keep smirks in the docking area and I've 
already branded myself a heretic, ok? ;-)

Anyway, since we now have larger space, and the storage in comps have 
increased, I, just for fun, have started to restore old notes, my old 
character and the subsector I developed (Subsector B/Hlakhoi. I've renamed 
it to align with the data I've found online.)
But.. My cherished Aliens 1: Aslan is gone.. I've got the data but has lost 
the key to Aslan governement types..
So I gathered this is the place to ask..

Does anyone have the key to Aslan government types (or rather G-N) or could 
point me in a direction where I can find it, book or otherwise?

I would be most grateful. There is no need to address the entire list, if 
this has been asked before, just mail me at shallager@hotmail.com

Regards,

Sinclair A.
Stockholm, Sweden

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 11:23:54 PDT
From: "Brandon Cope" <copeab@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Battledress/Battlesuit Protection (GT)

>From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com>
>
>Brandon Cope writes:
> > Note: In Star Mercs, it notes that TS armor can only give a maximum 
>bonus
> > of  + 250 DR, regardless of the actual DR of the "normal" armor. Also
> > worth  mentioning that the grav tanks use metal rather than laminate 
>armor.
>Done mostly for cost reasons; what with removal of 'advanced' armor at TL 
>12 I may generate rewrites which use laminate armor.
>

Also, take the Intrepid grav tank with a front DR of 25,000. It would take a 
475mm HEAT shell (gun) or huge 238mm HEAT warhead (missile) to penetrate 
that DR roughly half the time. So, given a high enough DR, laminate armor is 
really just more cost for little extra benefit.

A generous and sadistic GM,

Brandon Cope

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 13:24:48 -0500
From: Loren Wiseman <lkw@io.com>
Subject: J Andrew Keith CV

Gentlebeings,

I'm writing a short tribute to Andy for the upcoming Pyramid, and I'd like
to include a list of Traveller titles he authored...trouble is, I don't
have acess to my archives

Can someone here provide me with a list of titles that Andy wrote?



Loren Wiseman
     Art Director  / Traveller Line Editor
     Traveller Guru-in-Residence
     SJ Games
     LKW@IO.COM
     (512) 447-7866 VOX
     (512) 447-1144 FAX

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 11:40:51 -0700 (PDT)
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com>
Subject: Re: Battledress/Battlesuit Protection (GT)

Brandon Cope writes:
 
> Also, take the Intrepid grav tank with a front DR of 25,000. It would take
> a  475mm HEAT shell (gun) or huge 238mm HEAT warhead (missile) to
> penetrate  that DR roughly half the time. So, given a high enough DR,
> laminate armor is  really just more cost for little extra benefit.

That was the other reason.  HVKKs are more of a problem.

An upgrade to 'expensive laminate' on the Intrepid would increase cost from $15.6M to $18.6M (advanced metal is not available).

A change to 'standard laminate' on the Intrepid would reduce cost to $12.8M and it winds up with F6/18,000, O4/6,000.  Given the reduction in its primary gun due to the changes in huge energy weapon stats, this would at least mean it can penetrate its frontal armor by hotshotting its main gun, which otherwise it can't do.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 18:32:29 +0100
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com>
Subject: Re: Zot!

Black ICE <wombat@premier.net> writes:

>> Andrew Moffatt-Vallance wrote:
>> I actually think its not laser weapons that will killed manned aircraft but
>> masers. Much more effective to microwave the pilot.
>Given the nickname for US Air Force defense suppression aircraft ("Wild
>Weasels"), this give a whole new twist on "'Pop!' goes the weasel!"

LoL!

Dom

- ----------Dom Mooney---dom@cybergoths.u-net.com------------
                       MiB - Marines in Battledress
   "Protecting the Imperium from the Scum of the Galaxy"
Rob Prior's Mac software @ http://www.bits.org.uk/ 

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 15:28:32 -0400
From: "Jory Earl" <j-man@iname.com>
Subject: Re: archives

>Due to some unfortunate hassles with my computer, I've been out of touch of
the list for almost two months. >Therefore I'd like to know where could I
find the planetology and xenobiology threads. If someone has archived >them,
please tell me how I could obtain a copy. Also where are the digest archives
located, and how can I >access them?
>
.ps. Have I missed anything else interesting?
>
>-J2K

Email me and I will send what I saved.


___________________________________________________________
 J-Man
 ICQ# 2843475
 New Hampshire - U.S.A.
 Email : j-man@iname.com
 Home Page : http://www.geocities.com/~jman037/
___________________________________________________________

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 12:40:09 -0700 (MST)
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@Pharmacy.Arizona.EDU>
Subject: Re: Amorphous Aliens

Hmmm...we had a discussion some time ago abou such a race; the interesting
thing about them being that they would devlop calculus before they
developed algebra, since without digit's it would be unlikely that finite
math would come as easily to them as the nuances of change over time,
since they would be limited to application of varying amounts of
forse/area etc to manipulate their world.

This had implications for language, and in fact the duscussion started as
a discussion of a race that used color as their language. 

Bruce Johnson
University of Arizona
College of Pharmacy
Information Technology Group

Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs


On Tue, 19 Oct 1999, Charles Collin wrote:

> Hi all.
> 
> One thing I've always thought was "cool but hard to swallow" in SF is
> amorphous aliens.  Has anyone used something akin to these in their TU? 
> 
> To my mind there are two basic types of these:  The ameboid and the
> doppleganger.  Star Frontiers' Dralasites were a fun but silly version of
> the first type, while Odo from ST:DS9 is probably the most well-known
> second type. Ameboids can change shape and maybe texture or color to a
> limited degree but cannot imitate other beings or objects convincingly. 
> Dopplegangers are more flexible and can mimic things with high fidelity.
> 
> IMO, the latter type are a little too "science-fantasy" for a Traveller
> setting, but I've been toying with the idea of introducing an ameboid race
> to MTU.  My problem is coming up with a reasonable evolutionary course for
> their development.  
> 
> One rather bizarre and almost Lovecraftian notion I've been thinking about
> is what I call the "bag of bugs" model of amorphous development.  In this
> scenario the amoeba race is decended from some kind of hive-insect with a
> queen+workers type of society.  Occasionally such hive-insects will mass
> together for warmth and protection into a "big bundle of bugs" (the
> technical term :-). I was thinking, what if such an insect species
> developed the trait of creating a membranous sac around the mass for
> further protection?  What if, over time, hives developed into essentially
> single physical entities with queens at the center sending out pheromonal
> messages to control her "body", made up of a mass of workers.  In some
> sense this is what they already do, though in a more wide-rangeing and
> less direct way.  The workers in the mass could hook together to create
> different shapes.  Given enough time, sufficient control might be
> developed to create manipulatory limbs and such.  
> 
> As evolution proceeded, the workers would lose much of the "baggage" 
> needed to operate as individual entities, becoming essentially small cell
> masses with the ability to interlock with others in various configurations
> depending on the signals reaching them.  In order for intelligence to
> develop, the queen would have to become a massively hypertrophied thing
> with the brain integral to her alone, I think.  She would also become the
> seat of primary metabolic function and so on, sending out nutrients to the
> cell-masses that make up her body. 
> 
> Hmm, what about reproduction?  Essentially, one queen would lay another
> queen, who would "lay" a bunch of workers to act as a body for herself.  
> 
> Well, I said the idea was bizarre, didn't I? :-)  I'd really like to get
> people's input and reactions to this idea.  Too outlandish?  Are there
> major problems I haven't thought of?  
> 
> Ciao,
> Charles C.
> 
> 

------------------------------

End of Traveller-digest V1999 #1232
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